Dalowdown... Shut up!... Yeah, we believe in free enterprise, but what we're trying to say here is we want some of that enterprise too.

You see Da, regardless, there comes a point that excessive greed, rather than free enterprise, takes over and what happens then... Instead of putting money toward the REAL problems of this FREE Country of ours, such as cracks in bridges, water mains that are 50 years old and OH... How about simply keeping our streets safe, We taxpayers get to reinvest to ensure OUR FREE ENTERPRISE greedy Companies can maintain their billion dollar profits. Lord knows, its very important to make sure that those high paid salaries still get paid so the companies can retain the best executives to fail a company. All the while, us low-life FHAers work our ASSES off because they keep shipping jobs offshore. Their excuse is "Its a Global Market" BS... Its nothing but greed so they can profit that much more after being bailed out.

I'd hate for you to waste your time, but thanks for the "Good Luck" wish and for letting us know that after the 90 day moratorium on foreclosures is up, we might see more inventory. We can only hope.

dalowdown. The reason the country is in this mess is because of the "free market economy". Struggling home buyers not being given preference is just facilitating a deeper depression. Soon banks and other huge corps will own everything and be able to control the economy again, which we all know they can't be trusted to do!!

I have a question about my agents. We are first time home buyers and don't know a lot about buying a home. We have very nice, friendly agents, but we feel like we don't get much (if any) advice. We keep asking to see homes and get told there is not much out there, but when we start digging we find loads of properties. Then I email them to them and we get told almost all won't work. On top of that every place we see they tell us how nice the think it is... even when its obviously a dump. We have only put on eoffer in so far and they did not help us figure out what to offer at all. We offered to low, but they had told us it seemed like a good solid bid. Have we got bad agents or I'm I off on what i expect?

Nightmare!Nightmare!Nightmare! That is what it is like out there. I am in a short sale mess for 5 months now and still waiting for BofA to respond. I was in a short sale before that involved Countrywide that took 8 months until I lost the loan. I thought BofA would be any better, BIG mistake on my part. I would never ever ever recommend a short sale to anyone.

You can't refi for 6 months otherwise it's considered a cash out - which few lenders are willing to do. There's a lot of the bid high, get the house, then renegotiate.

I am pre-approved thru different lenders: FHA, 203K, NHSSV, Santa Clara Trust,CHDAP. This is in case that the seller would not want FHA, or is an As-Is condition and even almost non-inhabitable.

My financing can cover any situation. But guess what? I realized ir doesnt matter what type of financing you have. Bottom line is CASH IS KING.

I heard people cash out their 401K, buy cash, refinance once they get it, and put back the money.

Incredible!

So far we've been experiencing the same thing. My husband and I are trying to buy with an FHA loan. We have excellent credit and are actually buying $100,000 less than what we're Pre-Approved for with our lendor. We just don't have a lot for a down payment, so FHA was our best option.

It seems that we are being discriminated against because of our loan type. I don't understand why that isn't illegal. It's discrimination all the same. And it just makes no sense that the bank that owns these foreclosures makes these determinations based on the amount down and what kind of loan you have when they aren't even the institution making the loan!

And before anyone mentions the strict FHA appraisal qualifications, we are only looking at houses less than 8 years old that are in great condition. So that should not be a factor at all in this.

I just wish we had some sort of protection from what is obviously financial discrimination. (Our offers are usually higher as well.) Also since there's a federal mandate out there about the foreclosures why isn't there protection against the investors who are trying to profiteer from this? I think that priority should be given to families who are just trying to get into the housing market over investors who will ultimately lower property values in the neighborhood by creating more rental properties.

I did write to my Congressman about this and I encourage everyone else to do the same. This isn't working.

Think about it - if all of us who are good, qualified, family buyers would be able to buy, then we'd be buying appliances, furniture and everything in these neighborhoods. That helps the economy. Then we'd all have pride of ownership and would landscape and take care of these homes we're so desperate to purchase. And the property values would creep back up in neighborhoods full of foreclosures! We are the front-line to pulling the country out of recession. And we're not being given a seat at the table!

my wife and i have been experiencing this in the inner east bay; we've almost given up on actually placing bids because we know that a pack of investors and/or frenzied nutjobs are going to outbid us. i'm inclined to agree with those who say that this is an artifact of the slim inventory on the market (we've definitely been frustrated by lack of inventory!) ... I'd love to see the Redfin data guys crunch the numbers on inventory levels, days on market, number of bids, pct over/under asking and see if there's a real story here. Can do, Redfin?

"greedy investors" please people! What now? Doint you believe in free market economy. If I have to read one more posting of an FHA buyer who missed a deal bec. their 20K cash position was passed over by a seller/bank that is only interested in getting this inventory off the books. All entry level points in the bay area are experiencing competative environments now and will continue this way into the foreseeable future. Its a pain in the ass for buyers and their agents. I wont work that market segment, its a waste of time. Inventory will increase shortly, after Labor Day so hopefully there will be some relief for everyone. Good luck.

In my opinion, this "feeding frenzy," is false and is due to the summer buying season and the 90 day foreclosure moratorium on foreclosures which is obviously causing less REO inventory.
"Shadow" inventory refers to all the REO's banks are holding on to release beginning of September and in 2010.
If you really want that house you're bidding on, the only way to get it is to use the listing agent as YOUR real estate agent. Works like a charm. I bet they will ignore those 20+ offers.

same situation like everyone else, constantly getting outbid by buyers with all-cash or higher down payment offers. seriously, this market should give priority to first-time home buyers. with a 20% down, reg conventional financing, 30-day close with 10-day rather than standard 17-day inspections, and in most cases, 20% higher asking price, im still getting beat badly!

other than all-cash offers, serious buyers with excellent credit[ability] like myself (above 750) should more given more consideration. the last thing the states want is another huge wave of foreclosures since job unemployment is still on the rise...

sigh...

We have a long way to go ...

http://www.housingbubblebust.c...

Although conforming in SF county is as high as 729K, I understand that there is some resistance to loaning more than 618K even with 20% down in both cases. Any intelligence on this?

On another topic, as I look to be real estate seller someday, I will be grateful to choose the strongest buyer myself w/o restriction.

We're in the same position: 10 for 10 in San Jose. We're to the point where we consider it a hopeless situation. We have excellent credit, but we're first time home buyers with a small down using FHA financing. There should be a law against what's happening right now. Greedy investors are gobbling up everything within our range, making it impossible for first-time buyers to find a home. Keeps the renters renting, and is pulling some borderline neighborhoods down by tipping the balance toward more renters vs. home owners. Very sad.

Hi there people.

I have been overbid since June. I've been looking in San Leandro, San Lorenzo, and Oakland. My agent suggested looking in Hayward. The homes are much newer and there are a lot of REOs there.

What is shadow inventory?

I'm surprised that the banks are not releasing their expanding inventory now rather than later - when interest rates rise and buyers retreat.

@Crimson Wife
We've tried for homes in upper 700 range, over bid in most cases (7 homes until date, 4 in West side of Millbrae and 3 in San Francisco-Sunset area), but lost for all cash or higher percentage down or higher bid than us.

I had an FHA loan as well. I shopped for a house after I was already approved. I put down a $50K "non-refundable (after loan contingency removal) deposit" . PLUS a $100 per diem charge if it doesn't close on time (give yourself 45 days). You need to win on terms people. Sellers want to house to CLOSE. best price is not always best offer. FYI - got a large check back at close of escrow because I only needed 3.5% down. we actually went 7 days over, but it was a wash because I would have paid $88 per day in interest anyway. let me know if you want more details.

Amen! I totally agree. It was well said.

I have an FHA loan and after several frustrations and realized I don't have to stress myself. Why I have to be in the crazy position?

I just quit and just save my money for our real time come.

AMEN!

I have been "in contract" for a long...err I mean SHORT sale, for about 2 months now. Getting impatient, mostly because this is the first one I've finally gotten in contract with. I put in upwards of 18 or so offers on houses, all to be outbid by "investors" or the like with all-cash offers. And yes, my offers were about tens of thousands over asking, so I wasn't under-bidding.

I am pretty fed up, and I don't know what else to do but I try to keep my head up. I'm trying to buy my first house, by myself, and it's been hard enough as it is just going through the process, but also having to WAIT this long. This is absolute BS. I just came to vent, sorry :(

-Steph the Annoyed1

I tell you what... In 2005 when the first sign of sending jobs off shore began and the housing prices sky rocketed to unacceptable highs, I said (on many occassions):

“What better way to ruin the United States than to ruin it Financially"

Hmmm... Look at us today. Need I say more.

California has been shafted. If the job isn't sent overseas, it’s sent to the East Coast or the middle of no where. By all means, lets not allow non-citizens to have jobs that most people wouldn’t want; BUT… Please, lets send our high paying jobs that required high cost educations go to some other Country. I don’t know about you, but there is something wrong with that picture. Could it be that it is cause for the problem at hand? .

Its all a bunch of hooey. The people who have been in charge of our Company's have failed. The answer to it all is to cut cost; understandably so; however, lets see some top cuts. What is being saved when the company you work for has to higher ten people to do the same job of one extremely experience person in CA?

Now the are banks controlling the market, AGAIN. Sorry.. they just need to keep eating it on this one... They gave the loans. They are just as responsible as those that signed on the dotted line. Lower earnings expectations could save jobs and would be the beginning of a successful comeback; for the homeowner and the Country.

Though house prices have come down considerably, most areas are still ridiculously overpriced. The average household income, if they're lucky enough to still have one, cannot afford what is out there unless one is willing to wear a bullet proof vest 24 hours a day. The Corporations should be ashamed.

The investors need to step aside and let the responsible, hard working, real people have an opportunity at ownership. Its the right thing to do.

Enough of this rant! If you got this far… Thanks for reading, whether you agree or not! Can I have an AMEN!

The banks are playing us for suckers and they can afford to do that and hold on to the shadow inventory because we, the tax payers, foot the bill. But the banks are not at fault, *people are stupid*. It was only a couple of year ago when bidding wars made thousands of family overpay dearly. Ask the thousand that are $100,000 to $200,000 underwater if they will bid again. My grandfather use to say: "Crazy's not the one who's asking crazy is the one who pays"!

I like most others am an FHA'er. Let's see... the American Dream, buy your first house. Hmmm, in walks investor, nightmare begins. I truly think it is unfair that investors are allow to come in and steal a property out from under you. I put a bid on a house in my neighborhood, it was perfect, exactly where I wanted to be. A quiet, safe area. It was an REO. We were in first position out of seven. When the Listing Agent contacted the Asset Manager at the Bank, we found out that an investor went in the back door - contacted the bank directly with a cash offer $25,000 less than ours... POOF! Gone in an instant. It's a bunch of BS. I totally agree with Missi - where's the fun - All I see is greed!

Just where do all these buyers get the cash from? These must be investors. You cannot have hundreds of people with 200K cash ready to buy a house. It appears like they are the only ones that can buy these days. FHA buyers like me, even with excellent credit, can just forget about it.

Are all these bidding wars only happening on lower-priced homes? What's going on in the high $600's-mid $700's range?

My wife and I just started seriously looking at houses within the last month or two, and we have been in multiple-offer situations every time. One house we looked at on Minna St in Oakland had 19 offers. They sent the same counter-offer to the top 8, and we were probably within 3 of the top offer. We're finding it really frustrating because it is just not clear what the true value of a house should be, between the listing being underpriced, houses having pest and/or structural reports needing between 5 and 20k of work, and the inevitable bidding war. We are also in the first-time buyer FHA camp, and hoping to take advantage of the 8k tax stimulus that everyone else is as well. The points made in this and other blog posts about it being summer give us hope that in a month or two, things may slow down enough that all of us who are looking can find a home.

Bidding Wars is brutally existing in the real estate market nowadays. For the past 2 months, we have been looking at houses in the East Bay. Within those grueling time, 14 were rejected. As an FHA buyer, the light at the end of the tunnel was dimming. One 3/2 house was listed for $149,500 and we offered $191,500 with 4% closing cost and 3.5 down (FHA). It went to someone with an all cash offer. Now, tell me... where can a FHA buyer with little cash buy a decent house to live in during bidding wars, huh?

We even made 7 offers in one week! Hoping to get one...crossed fingers.

Patience...patience...patience...

For a little perspective, I found this on a Redfin blog:
http://forums.redfin.com/rf/bo...

Click on the link and find an article in USA Today where the Chief "economist" for the NAR says that a little blip of an upturn in 2007 shows (that we've already hit bottom!) I think we're seeing something similar now. Don't panic! There are a LOT of vacant houses right now and soon to be more. There WILL be a house for you. If you don't panic you won't fall victim to their games.

Also, to those like Doreen, who are losing out to all cash offers (especially those who have FHA). I think some of these listing agents know their properties won't appraise for what they're asking, so they're looking for all-cash with no appraisal (or loan) contingency. Although it feels like you've lost, you probably just dodged a bullet! Nice going!

BTW, I've also been looking for over a year and am resigned to the fact that I may need to keep looking for another year or more! (Yuk!)

To Helena's comment 7/30 - any Realtor worth anything AND who has the connections/relationships with other agents necessary to do business in this economy SHOULD be able to provide you addresses and details of how many offers were received and when. All it takes from there is simple MLS data research to find the closed price, original price, days on market, and any sale conditions that would've effected the outcome [e.g. all cash, FHA, contingencies etc.] If your Realtor ISN't providing this level of service as a minimum, you should find another Realtor.

David Thomas, Realtor® - Quality Service Certified Top 300 "Best of the Best" agent since 2006
Century 21 Bundesen
(707) 769-7188 direct
Web: www.SellThatHouse.net
Blog: http://sellthathouse.wordpress...
Email: SellThatHouse@Century21.com
Ca. Dept of Real Estate: #01290314

Helena said:

this information would be a lot more credible if one could verify the facts - with no address, fact checking is just a wish and the suspicious ones may think this is written in order to encourage buyers to bit well over asking….

6 offers in SF and Daly City and no wins. Our last offer was 15% over list and not a chance with 33 offers on the table. We are new to the game (1st house) but can't play anymore until we understand what's going on. Interesting result by approaching listing agent, however I don't know if I could do that to our agent who works very hard for us. I keep hearing about this "shadow inventory" the banks have. If indeed there is one, when will they release them?

Multiple offers just tells me the market is too hot.

I'll buy when no one wants a house - which means demand is down and it's cheap to own.

I may have to wait 1, 2, 5 or 10 years.
I'm patient.

It may not mean the bank did not find any acceptable offers. We lost out in Santa Clara and it was only off the mareket a couple of days. The party who won had found another place by the time the sellers picked an offer - out of the 10 on the table. It when on the market again and the listing agent told us not to bother to make an offer, he was telling his clients not to even consider an FHA loan - afraid we weren't as strong with a low downpayment. The next deal only lasted a few days too, as the buyers walked through it again and changed their mind. Went on the market again and someone else got it.

I was one of the 16 suckers that placed a bid on the 2/2.5 condo in San Jose... submitted a bid no where near what Redfin's client had... received the same rejection letter. Looking at the property on redfin right now, I see that it was de-listed on July 3, 2009... and now re-listed on July 31, 2009 in an "active" state. Just like Don says... "bank apparently did not find any acceptable [offers] and re-listed..."

Placed a bid on a house in San Leandro that was 20K over the asking price, but with 30 other bidders that offer was not accepted. The frustrating thing is that of the 30+ other offers, the bank apparently did not find any acceptable and re-listed the house.

I was in the market for a 2bed/1bath in San Francisco.

I've read from various blogs that true market value rarely matches the list price so I wasn't surprised by being overbid, but it still hurt every time. I was outbid in every property I put an offer in (6).

Personally, I don't blame any individual person or bank, but the system as a whole. I wish every sale was run as an auction instead of sealed bids so you could see your competitors, and not be mislead by both agents about phantom bids, or asked to offer your 'highest and best' offer from the start.

My 4th and 6th offer was eventually accepted but in both instances I juiced the system by going to the listing agent directly, so their incentive to advance my offer was greater because then they could dual rep both the seller and myself in the transaction. This worked for me as my winning offers were not the 2nd or 3rd highest and still won. Of course, I also lost when employing this strategy so this doesn't work in every instance. It gives 'an' edge, but it might not be 'the' edge that finally succeeds.

I guess what I'm saying is, in my limited experience, even though the game has tilted in the buyer's favor its still a game. A rough and poorly defined game. Expect to play hard or go home. But also don't shoot yourself in the foot by compromising too much because oppurunities will come to those with patience. After the first 20 houses and 3 submitted offers, I realized that there is no one "perfect" house, so just keep tight to your priorities and oppotunities will present itself. They did for me and I'm no one special so they will for you too.

Good luck to the rest of you still hunting. :-D

3035 FULTON ST 495K

is pending, no telling where it will close and how many real offers it had.

I agree with Ann, SithLord and SunnyGuy. We've likely got 2 more years before house prices stabilize, unemployment is accelerating along with foreclosures, so this little Q2 2009 rally will be a memory by the end of 2009 or beyond 2010.

In a macro sense, there are lots of 30+ year original owners out there looking to retire and cash out their largest investment and NorCal is population flat or shrinking, so housing supply will be plentiful.

Why overpay for the house that needs major work? Keep your cash supply up and move when it makes sense, multiple bids are what the 50K California realtors want you to think. How many realtors were there in 1999? Half that, 25K, and all of them will tell you its a great time to buy. Its always a great time for you to buy, no matter what the data are. Get past the hype, when the US census bureau's median household income for a region cannot afford the PITI and maintenance on the median house price without a 50% downpayment, prices won't maintain in the long term.

Not V-shape, more like L-shaped.

I completely agree with SithLord! I have seen bidding only on the REO's priced at very very low price! Yes, just wait for couple month, buyers will be gone after school starts!
Unemployment ~12%.. There won;t be any v-sape recovery in housing..

I think multiple bids are happening in the Bay Area right now because its Summer and because there are fewer "A" type properties out there. Summer is a traditional jump in housing because its a good time for families to move, get in the school district they want, move into town before the school year starts etc. There are also fewer "A" properties out there that have all the attributes we all want. Only the best properties are going so I wouldn't stress out about multiple bids. Don't get duped into overpaying and follow the desperate multiple bidders . Underbid if anything and stick to what the comps dictate and what you think the house is worth.

This is the last best time before the real depression hits - forget the hype on the multiple offers - August will be quiet and then September will get a bump and January/Feb 2010 and May 2010 - better to stay liquid and jump in then. BOL!

It's been psycho in the East Bay...I agree with Missi--we are 7 declines for 8 offers--a short sale we offered on back in April looks like it may finally come through. From Alameda to Martinez and points in between, every house we've offered on had at least 4 offers (Pinole), with the most being 31 offers (Oakland). Cash typically won out. This is in the mid 300's to high 400's. Sometimes it takes forever to hear back, adding to the frustration.

Oh yeah, the Berkeley house mentioned was on Fulton, and the other one I mentioned was on Parker.

Helena, I can verify the story about Berkeley, because we bid on that specific house in my neighborhood. Didn't get it, of course. Then, we got ready to bid on another Berkeley home, but discovered that 7 bids had already been submitted, and more were coming in. I fear we've missed our window of opportunity; it wasn't like this AT ALL 6 months ago, when we were being tentative buyers, waiting for the market to slump further. Alas!

This is happening pretty much everywhere for entry level homes. Just go look at a home the first few days on the market and it's like the door is swinging open all day with people waiting to get in. Try putting in a few offers and you'll get the idea when you've been outbid every time. Playing the appraisal/renegotiation game won't always work because agents and sellers are smarter now and ask for no appraisal contingency. The market keeps changing so you have to be in the game to know what's going on. It's not a great time to buy for some areas but it's a great time to sell.

this information would be a lot more credible if one could verify the facts - with no address, fact checking is just a wish and the suspicious ones may think this is written in order to encourage buyers to bit well over asking....

Oh dear god, this is crazy, we are 10 for 10, ten offers, ten different houses, 10 declines...we have been the best offer but all cash won out. I thought house buying was suppose to be fun...I think one thing they should consider is, Is this a primary residence or investment, and primary should be chosen first, but bottom line, money hungry banks and some realtors

It's a game-- you throw in a high offer and wait for the appraisal to come in... then, when it doesn't appraise, the contract gets re-negotiated.

People put in high offers KNOWING it's not going to appraise, but at least you're getting your foot in the door...

Everything in the lower third, and probably up to the bottom half seems to be getting multiple offers these days. especially in the east bay